Demographic questions and confirmation of consent.
*****
TA: First of all, what was the context that you were asked to use or directed to use the e-learning in your, your role?

P3: We’re asked to use it for mandatory training, generally.  That's most of the online training that we do is mandatory training that we’re asked to access it via our platform at work.  I think our platform is [learning system name] we use, and we go by that, and then it brings up all of our mandatory training.  But of course there are, there is other training that you can do independently, that you could probably access through different platforms as w, but mainly for me, it's mandatory training.

TA: Thank you for that. What are the experiences you'd like to tell me about, about using that e-learning.  And it could, it could be about any aspect of using it.

P3: So yeah, when I am using the online platform, the e-learning, a lot of the things that are on there like, for example, fire training. They give you a number of questions, and you go through, and then they give you scenarios and things to read.  But sometimes, to be honest, I don't read it all. I just skip to the end, and then just answer the questions. So that's my experience, and it's pretty easy to access. You just click on it, and then it just takes you to ‘launch course’, and you just go on it, and then you just do it.  It can take half an hour, it. Some of them take half an hour, 45 minutes. It just varies, but generally, I don't read all of the questions.  I just skip through them, and then go on to where you have to answer the questions.  I don’t read every single thing in it.

TA: Yeah, okay. Can you just tell me a little bit more about why you manage it in that way?

P3: Well, sometimes it's, it's just time management. I don't get a lot of time. Sometimes I don't get an hour to sit down and do mandatory training. Sometimes I only get about half an hour, and to me that's the quickest way of getting the mandatory training done, is just by skipping to the end, not necessarily skipping, but just going to the main bits that I need to know, and then going to the questions at the end, and that way I don't have to take a long time reading through absolutely everything.

TA: Yeah, okay. You referred to having time to do it.  Do you actually get time in your Trust to do it? Do you get time in your working time to do it?

P3: Not really, not at the moment, I mean. Now it's just changed because we're actually being given some protected time.  But before, no, we never did. We would just do it, if you know we'd had maybe a bit of a quieter time.  Maybe a patient didn't turn up, and we've got that spare half an hour, but it was just trying to fit it into your day to day, you know, clinical working life really.  Wouldn't really get allocated time as such. The only time we would get time to do training is if we were physically going somewhere, but not online.

TA: Right. And what your thoughts about that?

P3: It’s difficult.  It could be challenging.  It can be challenging to fit mandatory training in on the day to day basis, because you know, you know you have to get it done, and sometimes you feel pressured that you know that obviously you have to get it done. You're trying to think ‘well, how am I going to get it done'? And sometimes what I do is start it, save it, and then try and come back to it at a later date. You can also do that on some. If I only get like 15 minutes to do it.  I think, okay, I've got 15 minutes. I can, I could do part of it and then come back to it later and later date.

TA: Okay. Well, that's really useful, because not all systems allow that, do they? Could you tell me about where you do your training.

P3: So, I generally do my mandatory training where I work, in our unit.  So, I don't know. I guess you know where I work at the xxx centre in xxx, and that's where I do most of most of the mandatory training.  On the odd occasion I've done it.  There were a few modules, during the pandemic, that we could access online via, I think it's Cambridge university and it was specifically for [clinical setting], and I was accessing via the work's laptop, but at home.

TA: Right? Okay. How did you feel about that?  That you were doing it at home?

P3: Short laugh.  I don't really like doing it at home? I feel home is, you know time for me to unwind, to relax, spend time with my family, and having to do training at home, it's something I don't like to do, but if I have to, I will.  Also, you know there's, there's training that sometimes that, that we’re asked to attend. We don't have to, but it's good for our development, and it can be via reps.  So, medical reps might put on training sometimes, and that's online, and sometimes they are in the evenings, so I have no choice. I have to log on at home, if I want to do

TA: So, is that more like a webinar, or something like that?

P3: Yeah, sometimes.

TA: And what is what if it's not a Webinar? What does it look like if it's not a webinar?

P3: So, it might be just a forum.  But just have a discussion. You're just logging on to listen to updates and things like that.

TA: Yeah. Do you use any of that evidence towards your NMC re-validation or anything?

P3: Yes.  I haven't done prior to that but my recent validation, which I just done last year, I did.

TA: Okay. And that learning that you do in the forums and things, do you take that into practice with you? I mean, do you discuss it with others in practice? 

P3: Yeah, we do because it in the in the [clinical setting] world. There's quite a lot of changes that are happening, and lots of technology we keep on top of, and a few of us belong to a specific [clinical speciality] forum.  And we all, we have our own WhatsApp group in our team, and we share things from there that we've read, or articles that that we we've seen, and we often have a discussion about ‘oh, did you see this in the on the forum?’, or ‘I attended this Webinar on this, and we have a discussion between us, in the team. 

TA:  Okay. 

P3:  Yeah. I mean, so obviously technology.  It's difficult because there's so many things, so much technology that's coming out in our field of nursing that actually, we have to sometimes have more education around using that technology. So, it's not as easy just to take that into your workplace because you have to have extra training for that.

TA: Right. And is that training normally person to person or in person, training with equipment and things?

P3: It could be, it could be a group, so we might have a rep come in, and they demonstrate their, say, for example, a [medical device]. They will come and demonstrate a [medical device] to us, and they could do that face to face or on teams. We use Teams quite a bit as well.

TA: Okay, so that's in the moment then isn't that, I suppose.

P3: Yes

TA: And you're getting feedback from them about what it is you're-learning about?

P3: Yes.

TA: It's not so much a case for the mandatory training, but what do you think about the feedback that you get on that training from the system, or do you not really feel there is any feedback?

P3: We don't get feedback. All we do is just say we've completed it, and then you just get a tick. And then it's added to your electronic record, at the Trust. We don't really get any feedback on it. That's it. We just get a tick. And to say, ‘thanks, you've completed it’, and that's it.

TA: Yeah, and you have to have a pass mark I suppose, that you must meet.

P3: We have a pass mark. I think it's either 80 to 100%. I can't remember, I think it's 100%

TA: Okay. But do you, in the sense of doing that learning, ever miss engagement of working with other people or anything like that? 

P3: Sometimes. I do actually prefer going face to face training. I'm a social person, you know, I like being in a group environment. I like seeing other people's ideas.  Sometimes when you're doing online training, you're in a room on your own. You're just looking at a screen. You're just pressing a button, answering the questions. And sometimes you can kind of zone out a little bit, you know. I think if you're in a group your brain's more engaged. You know, you have to contribute.  Somebody's asking your opinion, whereas if you're doing it online, you're just literally pressing a button. And I have to be honest, I do zone out sometimes.

TA: Yeah.  

P3: If I think I’ve missed out, I’ve lost concentration, I can go back.  And that's a good thing. You can go back to read the questions again.

TA: Yeah. 

P3: So that that's one good, one good advantage of that. You can do that. 

TA: What are your thoughts about the choice about the learning, well, not necessarily choice, but the way that nurses are told what learning to do?

P3: So we don't really get a choice. We don't really get a choice as to topics, or what training we're doing. It's just set, and we just complete it. So, obviously there are certain ones if you're working a hospital environment, it's always going to be basic life support. There's always going to be manual handling, so they're the core, you know ones you have to do.  In fact, most of them are core ones, because if you don't do them then you can't work for the Trust, so you have to do them.  And you don't have a choice, you have to do them you know.

TA: So that learning is not really in your control because somebody else is saying you've got to do it. You got to prove it.

P3: Yeah. 

TA: Leading on from that, what your thoughts about the relevance of the training that you've been asked to do. Have you ever had any thoughts about whether it's all relevant?

P3: Yeah, it is all relevant because things change, so for example I’ll just use basic life support, the way, that’s changed slightly during COVID, so they try to ensure it is relevant, so they update it. So it is relevant to our practice, and we all need to know how to do that. And you know it is nursing, and that's a core part of it. But that's just one example. They do. They do update it, so it is relevant to our role. I can't think of anything that's not relevant, really.

TA: Okay, so your evidence of learning through the mandatory training, that goes straight through to a Trust record somewhere? It's all recorded on your system?

P3:  Electronic staff record, it’s logged on there and you can log on to the electronic staff record to see how compliant you are.  And you get a big mark, 80 or 100, you know. We have a big tick to say that you're compliant. It's all listed, all of your online training. All your mandatory training is all listed. It's very easy to find so, and you know you've completed it. So you get a big tick at the end of it.

TA: You've talked about other things that you've been to, like the forums which are more sort of personal interest. How do you choose what to do with those types of things?

P3: So, we get sent emails from medical companies, drug companies. We get emails from [medical device] companies, and they just get sent to our works email. I dip in and out of that, like there’s one coming up recently, for something I think oh, no, I’ve done that. I've done that like last year. I don't want to do it. I don't have to, so I just pick and see which ones I feel that would be relevant to, like there’s one for Ramadan coming up soon, and I saw it in my email box. I thought, okay. I've done some education around Ramadan, but it was a couple of years ago, so I probably will log on to that one. Some of those ones are with doctors, professors in, you know, specialists in their field, and sometimes they do it in the evenings. They often give you a choice with 2 times so, evening or time during the day.  Often we can't do during during the day because of the commitments due to work. In the evening I could potentially do it for an hour.  They’re generally about an hour long, so that's fine. 

TA:  So for those ones you would do it in your own time. 

P3:  Yeah.

TA:  Do you get any recompense or anything for doing it. 

P3:  No.

TA: Okay. And then, if you did do one of those sessions, then would you take that back and talk about it in your clinic with other colleagues?

P3: Yeah, because that would be yeah, that would definitely be relevant how to manage a [clinical situation] during Ramadan. I mean, that's a big cohort. That's an example. That's a big cohort of our patients. So, yes, definitely, that would be relevant. And yes, we would definitely use that in our practice, because, because we're going to need to know how to manage those patients.

TA: Have you got any thoughts about, the thought that now NMC are saying that we should be all doing CPD in our own time, and they are advocating online e-learning as a way of doing our learning for CPD?

P3: If you ask, probably a few of my colleagues, all of us have done at some point or another done training in our own time. That's not an unusual thing, but if it's mandatory, that's a different thing. But if it's our choice to dip in and out, do extra reading, that is all part of CPD doing the extra reading around topics. That is all part of it, and all of us have done you know, university courses.  We’re all used to doing that extra curriculum reading because we have to, and we feel that we have to keep on top of things that are going on. It's what makes us you know, the better nurses. We need to know what's going on. But I think, having to be told that you have to do it in your own time, that's different.  Choosing to do it when you've got time, that's what a lot of us do, and it and most of us would do that.

TA: Yeah. Why would you do that?

P3: Because we don't get time during our work time, to be honest. So, a lot of us, if we want to do some extra reading, if we want to do some extra learning, if we want to understand about a new [medical device] we would have to read about it. We would have to do that in our own time because when we’re working we've got patients coming in face to face. If we're not doing that, we have other patient contact. So, we’re just pulled in lots of different directions, and you just don't have the time during the day most of the time. There's a very occasional time, as I say things are changing because we're allocated, only recently, protected time.  So, that protected time can be used for extra learning, education, doing presentations and things like that. So now that's happened, I think potentially we won't have to do that in our own time.

TA: Yeah, do you know why that's happened? Why, that change has come about?

P3: I really don't, I don't know, I don't, no. It was just a discussion that we had. I think where we are we've had a new consultant. She's very keen for us all to do more learning for us to share our learning. We do lunch time, education. So, we're all allocated, say, for example, it's a Tuesday lunch time for half an hour. One of us will do a topic, a presentation that's relevant. So, it could be on anything that's linked with [clinical speciality]. Mine was on [clinical speciality] and the mouth, and I did a presentation for 10 to 15 minutes to my colleagues. So, we're doing that every week now.  But to prepare for that, I had to do that presentation in my own time. I didn't get any extra time to do it, and it was, it was eating into my weekend. So, over the 2 weekends before I had to present. I had to prepare. I had to do the extra reading. I had to find the articles, I had to do the actual presentation. So, I think now actually having that protected time is a good thing, because we all need to keep on top of what's going on, and actually being able to have that protected time allows us to do that without the extra stress or pressure trying to fit everything in. We need time to relax at home and to be having to do extra.  If you want to do it that's fine, not a problem. But I think now we've got that protected time to do that extra training, is a brilliant, is a really good thing, and I'm really, really pleased that we've got that. 

TA:  Yeah. And that involves e-learning in a way doesn't it, because you've had to go away and do the research for your topic, so. 

P3:  I think people have this misconception about doing e-learning, you know that you could dip in and out of a lot of it. But when you're actually having to attend a University course, they have to let you go to do that.  Was e-learning seen differently. I don't know?  That's just kind of what I get, because I think it's ah, it’s only an e-learning, you know you can go. You can do that little bite sized chunks at different time. But, if you're actually having to go to university, you know you've got that whole day. Whether, I know it's going to involve travelling part of it, but you have got a whole day that's kind of protected.  With e-learning, that doesn't really seem to happen as much. 

TA:  No. And do you think that makes the feeling about e-learning different, or the value placed on it by maybe the employers and people like that?

P3: Yeah, I mean, apart from mandatory training. Obviously, that has to be done. I think anything else is not valued as much, the e-learning part of it. In the past it was like “oh, well, you know, we might be able to give you half a day, or on this day, to do it”.  But often, you wouldn't get that, because you know, due to staffing levels, you'd have it to cover for somebody else, and it just never really worked.

TA: Yeah. I suppose we go into nursing knowing that we've got to do CPD at the end. Maybe we don't know that when we first start, but by the end of our programme we probably do. 

P3:  We all accept that.  We all know we have to do CPD, and it's just what, as you said, what value is put on that as the e-learning side of it. I think that needs to be valued more, you know, giving us extra time, which now we have got. So I'm grateful for that, which is new. I've never had that before. Protected time! That's new.

TA:  Oh, that's really positive. It's good to hear.

P3: Yeah, really good. 

TA:  Have you ever thought of doing any specific e-learning courses outside of your mandatory training for your own interest or anything else?

P3: Yeah, there was one I was looking at actually, which I found on one of the forums to do with [clinical speciality] and I cannot remember the name of it. I was reading it yesterday before I went into work, and you have to pay for it yourself, but it's something that I would consider doing.  Unless I spoke to my Trust and they, because it is relevant to [clinical speciality]. I can't really remember what the course of it, what the title of it is, but it is it's all to do with [clinical speciality], but it is extra learning for myself, and it is relevant to my role. So, I was looking at it yesterday and I thought well, that's quite interesting. So, it might be a discussion if I could have it my next one to one?

TA: Yeah.

P3: Because potentially, if it's going to be an enhancement to my role, and it's going to help the patients (raised tone), then I think, you know it might be a discussion we can have, or I can have.

TA: Yeah. And were you aware of any free e-learning that you might access?

P3:  No. There’s probably some out there, but I'm not aware of any. It's the time issue, because working full time is difficult enough. On the days off you're doing everything else that you need to do so on top of, you know, doing the extra CPD, extra learning, is trying to fit that into your family life, the weekends.  It is challenging. 

TA:  Yeah. You said, you've done most of your e-learning, you do the mandatory learning, you do in your practice settings. So, you've not experienced any particular technical difficulties or issues recording your progression or anything like that.

P3: No, not really. I mean, it just gets saved automatically. Obviously, you do have to complete every question. You can't just pick the questions, you have to complete them all. If you do have to log off, it just saves where you've got up to. But no, I mean obviously, we do get wi-fi issues all the time 

TA:  At work, or at home?

P3:  At work.  All the time. We've had constant issues where we are. It's either the laptop not working, we can't get on the Internet. There's always something, always something to do with Wi-fi. 

TA: Yeah. So, how would that impact if you had suddenly a half an hour or 15 minutes you could quickly do something, and then you had the Wi-fi issues. How do you think that would make you feel?

P3: Stressed really, because you can spend all your time trying to log on. Trying then ringing IT about the issue, then waiting for them to contact you. In fact, sometimes you think I'm not going to bother today, because by the time I've sorted all that out. Your half an hour, your spare bit of time is now no longer a spare bit of time, because you can't get on, or you've spent your time ringing IT to say to them, actually, I've got a problem.  Waiting for them to call back to you, and then the time is gone.

TA:  Yeah. So when would you make that assessment if you tried to log on, there was difficulties. That's when you'd make that judgment, is it? 

P3:  Yeah, I would then just phone, or … well, if I can't get on it’s difficult to send an email, but generally phone IT, and then they've got a long waiting list and say yes, we've got logged your call. We'll phone you back soon as we can, and often that's not within half an hour. It could be a half a day. Sometimes we've waited longer.

TA:  So then you’d stop?

P3: Yeah.

P3: Do you think? Does that have an implication? Say you've left all your training until the last minute.  Would you then need to speak to your manager or anything to say that you've been having problems?

P3:  Yeah, I would definitely say to the manager, because every month we have a unit meeting, and all of those people that not up to date with their training, that is, logged. So if there's any issues you need to let them know. 

TA: Yeah. How does that make you feel when you can't talk somebody to sort it. It's all online, so you can't get the booking done, then?

P3:  It just makes you feel stressed. And you just think oh no, my training’s out of date.  You know, the manager’s going to be informed by our HR, that the training’s out of date, and then you're trying your utmost to get online, and you, you know, on on the Internet to try and get it completed, and then it doesn't work.  You’re just completely, it is, it's just really stressful. It could just really stress, and then you think, okay, I'll try again tomorrow.  Tomorrow comes, and then you have another IT issue, like a lead’s not working, or something’s not working.  There's always something every day with Wi-fi that you just can't get on. It is obviously not with training, even for accessing patient records sometimes, you just can’t. You know I'd be just hit and miss. You just can't get on it.

TA: Gosh, that's a challenge.

P3: Yeah. So, with training because I couldn’t get online I spoke to my manager. She said, oh, we are aware of that. We've been told. So, that's fine. Sometimes they are aware and sometimes they're not aware, so I would just let the manager now and just say look, I've tried. And I have to keep checking every day when the Wi-fi works.

TA: That does sound stressful. To finish, I wondered if you had anything to summarise your thoughts about e-learning are in general as CPD?

P3: E-learning in itself, it does give you bit of flexibility to be able to dip in and out when you've got the extra half an hour, when the Wi-fi is working properly.  Other than that,  there is a place for it, definitely. It can be isolating doing it all on your own. If you're doing it every course on your own, it can be quite isolating sometimes. You’re only seeing somebody through a screen. You're not really interacting with anyone and a lot of it is just answering questions, and therefore you just think, oh, it's another task you have to complete. So, we all do it, and we do it all the best, the best that we can to make sure it is completed and up to date, but, unfortunately, the same things do transpire against us, like not being able to get on Wi-fi, like your laptop not working. Yeah, it has its own challenges, but it, there is a place for it, I would say.

TA: Okay. Thank you.


